mid/side mixing?

[Matt]

I use the mid side option of slates vbc-mu plug in on the master. Not sure I'm truly doing any major mid side work. And what I'm doing would probably fall more under mastering anyways.

But with the kick and snare thumping down the middle, I use a higher threshold (say -6) on the middle than the sides (say -9). That way I'm getting about the same amount of gain reduction (I usually go for only 1 to 2 db of compression) for both the mid and the sides. Then I bring the sides up maybe a db or 2 to make the mix sound a bit wider.

[drsaamah]

I am trying to do a mid/side recording and mix at the moment. I am having an issue where the side tracks aren't canceling out when the polarity of one track is flipped. Anyone know what I could be doing wrong?
I have recorded a "Mid" track and a "Side" track. I then copied and pasted the region from the "Side" track to a second Side track. Both these tracks are routed to the Master bus and nothing else (no inserts, aux, Mixbuses, sends, etc). I flip the polarity on one of these two tracks. Before I pan the tracks to their respective sides, I should expect them to cancel out perfectly. But that does not happen. According to the V.6 signal flow diagram (https://www.harrisonconsoles.com/mixbus/...ignal-flow) the polarity flip should be immediately following the Disc playback.
Any ideas??
p.s. I am on version 7, if that makes a difference.

[Clint]

The two side tracks must have exactly the same eq and gain feeding into the bus in order to cancel-
I’m sure you know this but there are so many controls and settings on the channel strips, it’s easy to have a knob turned or button pressed without initially realizing it.
I try to help myself a little by duplicating the track, then before doing anything else, (after flip the polarity) make the sides a group so anything I do to one happens to both.
Failing that, there’s always MSED-
https://www.voxengo.com/product/msed/

[drsaamah]

The two side tracks must have exactly the same eq and gain feeding into the bus in order to cancel-
I’m sure you know this but there are so many controls and settings on the channel strips, it’s easy to have a knob turned or button pressed without initially realizing it.
I try to help myself a little by duplicating the track, then before doing anything else, (after flip the polarity) make the sides a group so anything I do to one happens to both. 
Failing that, there’s always MSED-
https://www.voxengo.com/product/msed/

Thank you so much for the reply.  I doubt I overlooked any track processing but I will double check when I get to the studio tonight.  If nothing else, thank you for the Voxengo recommendation! It looks promising

[drsaamah]

update (months later) Harrison Mixbus is not working in this regard.
Can anyone take 2 minutes to verify or disprove my experience?
Any region of audio (regardless of how it is recorded) if copied, pasted to a separate track, and then polarity inverted, should cancel out 100% with the original region if there is no processing on those tracks.
This is not happening in Mixbus and I need a solution.  Is anyone getting different results?
If not, what is Mixbus doing to the audio?  The signal flow section of the manual shows polarity switch in between the program material (be it disk or input) and the trim knob.  If trim knobs are set to 0, EQ, Filters, and Comp are disengaged, no mixbus sends, both tracks to the Master bus... why would these regions not cancel?  I'm not here to whine about the program.  I want to understand what the software is doing so I can address the problem appropriately.

[drsaamah]

Also, I have confirmed that this problem does not exist in Ardour 6. This is specific to Mixbus.

[jeff_sloan]

I am interested and will try this myself once I get back to the studio.

Have you made sure that the track's transients line up PERFECTLY?
May have to fix some timing?

[drsaamah]

I am interested and will try this myself once I get back to the studio.

Have you made sure that the track's transients line up PERFECTLY?
May have to fix some timing?

yes yes. i appreciate the thoroughness but mid/side mixing is not something I am new to. i have triple and quadruple checked my implentation.  Works fine in Ardour not in Mixbus.

[Dingo]

@drsaamah I have tested copy track and I get 100% phase cancellation.
Clint gave you sage advice earlier (post13) to duplicate the track, this works 100%.
I have tested copy to a new track using Playhead not Mouse.
My copy track phase cancels completely.

[drsaamah]

@drsaamah I have tested copy track and I get 100% phase cancellation.
Clint gave you sage advice earlier (post13) to duplicate the track, this works 100%.
I have tested copy to a new track using Playhead not Mouse.
My copy track phase cancels completely.

I appreciate the confirmation! Then I must have set something weird in my project.  I'll get a mixer window screenshot when I get back to the studio to see wth I'm doing wrong here.
Thank you, @Dingo!