Posts: 233
Threads: 13
Joined: Jan 2016
Reputation:
15
Well put, Tassy.
Skyking 11, don't confuse "Gain Staging " with "Make-up Gain". Two different things.
Win10 64 i5 3330 Quad Core, AVL/MXE i5, MB 3-9, MB32C 3-9, Tascam US 20x20(2), Tascam 388, Alesis HD24, Alesis ML 9600(2), A&H GL2400, Soundcraft Studio Spirit 24, Roland Integra7, Roland S-50, M-Audio Hammer 88, ART/ MPA Gold/ TPSII/Pro Channel(2)/Pro VLA(3), lots of tubes
Posts: 3,148
Threads: 441
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation:
40
09-01-2022, 09:16 AM
(This post was last modified: 09-01-2022, 09:19 AM by Tassy.)
Why sould it be set to the "original" volume? No such rule! Makup gain is for that in some plugins in order not to be cheated by the "louder is better" sindrome  , I never use auto makup because I made a lot tests and itdoes not result in the same sound in most plugins as a really makup/output/fader by hand. " auto" anything is decided by an algorithm and not me.
"I was told" is dangerous!  Depends on the one who told you...
Best is to experiment yourself and decide what to believe or not. What is working for you and what not.
Win7/64, Mixbus32C, Mixbus2.5 the Queen UR22, Dynaudio BM5A MKII, Pc all SSD,
Posts: 120
Threads: 21
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation:
2
Ok so for example I gain stage my kicks, bass, sub etc to -18 so when I start mixing, let’s say I eq the kick and on the vu it’s above or below that -18 area I adjust the output gain of that plugin back to that general area and adjust the fader as needed in the mix etc. I do this so that my plugins get input from that -18 general area, some call it (sweet spot)
Posts: 3,148
Threads: 441
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation:
40
09-02-2022, 11:21 AM
(This post was last modified: 09-02-2022, 11:22 AM by Tassy.)
Something like that
A plugin can be considered a portable radio that has a low battery: it gives distorted sound, If a larger battary is put in it also gives a strange sound even can go wrong.
But the radio works well in a certain interwall even if the battery gets a bit weaker. You do not change the battery by 5 minutes to get the same input
Regarding the plugins, as I wrote, if the input is small no or little harmonics are generated by the plugin. if the input increases the harmonics start appearing.
As to go wrong? Yes in DAWS that do not have separate mono and stereo tracks (eg Mixcraft) if you put a mono plugin in a track that has stereo wave in it (the wave form is always mono) the plugin can distort a lot because it gets twice the strength of the signal.
So the plugin does not need always -18 dB, as example, it can be less or more as well, say 20-30% who cares. If you want some "color" by the harmonics and you stay always at -18, you will never get it or so little that cannot be even recognised.
I advise you to put some samples of 100 Hz, 500Hz, 1k, put there a compressor or any plugin that has harmonocs and see on a spectrum analyzer how the harmonics go up or down depending on the input of the plugin.
I tested a lot I genarraly use and also get to know whether the plugin gives even, odd or both harmonics, or the harmonics get generated anly on lower frequencies or higher.. or has even harmonic distortion (not unpleasent) so there is a lot to experiment to gain knowledge, sometimes different from what is written in the manuals
best
Tassy
Win7/64, Mixbus32C, Mixbus2.5 the Queen UR22, Dynaudio BM5A MKII, Pc all SSD,
Posts: 120
Threads: 21
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation:
2
(09-02-2022, 11:21 AM)Tassy Wrote: Something like that
A plugin can be considered a portable radio that has a low battery: it gives distorted sound, If a larger battary is put in it also gives a strange sound even can go wrong.
But the radio works well in a certain interwall even if the battery gets a bit weaker. You do not change the battery by 5 minutes to get the same input
Regarding the plugins, as I wrote, if the input is small no or little harmonics are generated by the plugin. if the input increases the harmonics start appearing.
As to go wrong? Yes in DAWS that do not have separate mono and stereo tracks (eg Mixcraft) if you put a mono plugin in a track that has stereo wave in it (the wave form is always mono) the plugin can distort a lot because it gets twice the strength of the signal.
So the plugin does not need always -18 dB, as example, it can be less or more as well, say 20-30% who cares. If you want some "color" by the harmonics and you stay always at -18, you will never get it or so little that cannot be even recognised.
I advise you to put some samples of 100 Hz, 500Hz, 1k, put there a compressor or any plugin that has harmonocs and see on a spectrum analyzer how the harmonics go up or down depending on the input of the plugin.
I tested a lot I genarraly use and also get to know whether the plugin gives even, odd or both harmonics, or the harmonics get generated anly on lower frequencies or higher.. or has even harmonic distortion (not unpleasent) so there is a lot to experiment to gain knowledge, sometimes different from what is written in the manuals
best
Tassy
Thanks I’ll look into the way I do things on my end, I’m always learning.
Posts: 120
Threads: 21
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation:
2
(09-03-2022, 04:35 AM)Skyking11 Wrote: (09-02-2022, 11:21 AM)Tassy Wrote: Something like that
A plugin can be considered a portable radio that has a low battery: it gives distorted sound, If a larger battary is put in it also gives a strange sound even can go wrong.
But the radio works well in a certain interwall even if the battery gets a bit weaker. You do not change the battery by 5 minutes to get the same input
Regarding the plugins, as I wrote, if the input is small no or little harmonics are generated by the plugin. if the input increases the harmonics start appearing.
As to go wrong? Yes in DAWS that do not have separate mono and stereo tracks (eg Mixcraft) if you put a mono plugin in a track that has stereo wave in it (the wave form is always mono) the plugin can distort a lot because it gets twice the strength of the signal.
So the plugin does not need always -18 dB, as example, it can be less or more as well, say 20-30% who cares. If you want some "color" by the harmonics and you stay always at -18, you will never get it or so little that cannot be even recognised.
I advise you to put some samples of 100 Hz, 500Hz, 1k, put there a compressor or any plugin that has harmonocs and see on a spectrum analyzer how the harmonics go up or down depending on the input of the plugin.
I tested a lot I genarraly use and also get to know whether the plugin gives even, odd or both harmonics, or the harmonics get generated anly on lower frequencies or higher.. or has even harmonic distortion (not unpleasent) so there is a lot to experiment to gain knowledge, sometimes different from what is written in the manuals
best
Tassy
Thanks I’ll look into the way I do things on my end, I’m always learning.
Also so what your saying is let’s say I boost a track Input passed -18 on a kick drum and I’m adding saturation but then gain stage it back down to -18 after, I will lose some of those harmonics.
I do remember a plugin I used to add like little harmonics. When I gain staged it back to -18 I couldn’t tell a difference but before when signal was louder it sounded nice but I usually gain stage to see if the plugin is adding something I like and not to be fooled by loudness.
|
