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+---- Thread: ACE Compressor - Release Speed (/thread-9921.html)
ACE Compressor - Release Speed - Jostein - 02-03-2021
Hi,
I'm a big fan of the ACE Compressor and have started to use it side-chained, I do however miss one control:
Is it possible to add a release speed function to it as well?
I use compressor sidechaining for letting other instruments get some space by ducking a track slightly (not as an effect), but I really miss something that can control the speed of the release (or envelope) so things sound right when the ducked signals have it's gain back. A speed control would be very nice for this.
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - madmaxmiller - 02-03-2021
(02-03-2021, 02:17 PM)Jostein Wrote: Hi,This is essential for such work. But "my" ACE compressor has release time... or do you mean something like a release "ratio", a release *over* a certain time instead of *after* a certain time? Haven't seen that anywhwere (yet) but then I'm not collecting plugins either...
I'm a big fan of the ACE Compressor and have started to use it side-chained, I do however miss one control:
Is it possible to add a release speed function to it as well?
I use compressor sidechaining for letting other instruments get some space by ducking a track slightly (not as an effect), but I really miss something that can control the speed of the release (or envelope) so things sound right when the ducked signals have it's gain back. A speed control would be very nice for this.
Cheers, MMM
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - Jostein - 02-03-2021
(02-03-2021, 03:50 PM)madmaxmiller Wrote: This is essential for such work. But "my" ACE compressor has release time... or do you mean something like a release "ratio", a release *over* a certain time instead of *after* a certain time? Haven't seen that anywhwere (yet) but then I'm not collecting plugins either...
Cheers, MMM
I think that the common phrase, release time, is a term that is a reason why many people have a hard time understanding compressors, "release point" would be better in my opinion. With release speed, I mean the time it takes from the release (when it's starting to recover from compression) to where the compressor has fully recovered.
Let's say that a track with a drum is controlling a track with a gong (I want to hear the drum body when it's hit, not drowned by the gong) which has a compressor that is chain-sided to the drum track:
If the time the compressor is using from releasing to letting go is too long, then it will often sound unnatural when it has the full gain back again because it will fade in too slowly after the drumbeat is finished, it will "pump" instead of just take over the soundscape again. If it's too short, then the end ringing of the drumbeat will have trouble with the gong that's coming too early back.
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - madmaxmiller - 02-03-2021
(02-03-2021, 05:30 PM)Jostein Wrote:(02-03-2021, 03:50 PM)madmaxmiller Wrote: This is essential for such work. But "my" ACE compressor has release time... or do you mean something like a release "ratio", a release *over* a certain time instead of *after* a certain time? Haven't seen that anywhwere (yet) but then I'm not collecting plugins either...
Cheers, MMM
I think that the common phrase, release time, is a term that is a reason why many people have a hard time understanding compressors, "release point" would be better in my opinion. With release speed, I mean the time it takes from the release (when it's starting to recover from compression) to where the compressor has fully recovered.
Hence my question. It would be cool indeed to have such a tool, haven't seen one yet. Basically an ADSR for compression.
MMM
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - Dingo - 02-04-2021
(02-03-2021, 02:17 PM)Jostein Wrote: Hi,
I'm a big fan of the ACE Compressor and have started to use it side-chained, I do however miss one control:
Is it possible to add a release speed function to it as well?
I use compressor sidechaining for letting other instruments get some space by ducking a track slightly (not as an effect), but I really miss something that can control the speed of the release (or envelope) so things sound right when the ducked signals have it's gain back. A speed control would be very nice for this.
Jostein, are you asking for a Hold option: the amount of time before the Release occurs ? OR the Depth option: at which point the release occurs ?
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - Jostein - 02-04-2021
(02-04-2021, 02:25 AM)Dingo Wrote:(02-03-2021, 02:17 PM)Jostein Wrote: Hi,
I'm a big fan of the ACE Compressor and have started to use it side-chained, I do however miss one control:
Is it possible to add a release speed function to it as well?
I use compressor sidechaining for letting other instruments get some space by ducking a track slightly (not as an effect), but I really miss something that can control the speed of the release (or envelope) so things sound right when the ducked signals have it's gain back. A speed control would be very nice for this.
Jostein, are you asking for a Hold option: the amount of time before the Release occurs ? OR the Depth option: at which point the release occurs ?
I believe that the two options you are asking me about here might be the same thing! :-) What I want is to control the time it takes from the release occurs until the compressor is released.
If you look at the end of the timeline in the attached ADSR picture, you will see the release point and from there, it takes some time for the release to fade out. It's that time I want to be able to control.
This release time varies from compressors to compressors, so one might have to try different compressors just for that reason (and sometimes perhaps without knowing why I suspect).
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - sunrat - 02-04-2021
What is the y axis meant to represent in your diagram, Jostein? Amount of compression? It would only be flat like that for a sound with uniform volume like a synth bass with constant velocity. For instruments like drums, vocals, acoustic instruments the compression level would vary in that time.
Have you tried the x-42 compressor? It has a Hold switch which helps prevent pumping.
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - Jostein - 02-04-2021
(02-04-2021, 05:47 AM)sunrat Wrote: What is the y axis meant to represent in your diagram, Jostein? Amount of compression? It would only be flat like that for a sound with uniform volume like a synth bass with constant velocity. For instruments like drums, vocals, acoustic instruments the compression level would vary in that time.
Have you tried the x-42 compressor? It has a Hold switch which helps prevent pumping.
The y axis is just a representation of the activity of the compressor, three parts: It kicks in (slowly if it's a long attack) then as long as the trigger signal keeps the compressor busy, and finally the release.
I have tried many compressors, including the x-42 compressor (a really good one, but does not have a side-chain functionality), Presswerk (an amazing one) which did not fit the current project I'm working on. All that can be heard on the current project when the ducking is active is a gong (sometimes two) and a very active hand drum (when it's in use). The compressor that I have tried that does the best job for me in my current project is the ACE Compressor. The client is extremely happy with it, but I hear room for improvements.
With the danger of turning the caps lock on: I still want a release time control, every compressor should have one - At least for Christmas! :-) It's kinda frustrating that I'm not able to express myself in a fashion that everybody understands, but I will work harder to improve myself.
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - PBuryk - 02-04-2021
@Jostein -
As MMM suggested, we can discuss your diagram in terms of a standard ASR/ADSR (envelope terminology) - Attack/Sustain/Release (Attack/Decay/Sustain/Release).
Speaking in these terms, a typical compressor (eg, the one on the MB mixer channel strip) has an AR (Attack/Release) response.
Your diagram shows an ASR (Attack/Sustain/Release) response; the added feature being the Sustain component.
Others, here, have described it as "Hold" - same idea, different term. Either way, it seems that it is this section of the compressor's overall response
that you are looking for - that is, sustain (or hold) the compression level until the side-chain signal has ceased, then implement the (standard) release control.
Cheers!
Patrick
RE: ACE Compressor - Release Speed - Jostein - 02-04-2021
(02-04-2021, 07:53 AM)PBuryk Wrote: As MMM suggested, we can discuss your diagram in terms of a standard ASR/ADSR (envelope terminology) - Attack/Sustain/Release (Attack/Decay/Sustain/Release).
Speaking in these terms, a typical compressor (eg, the one on the MB mixer channel strip) has an AR (Attack/Release) response.
Your diagram shows an ASR (Attack/Sustain/Release) response; the added feature being the Sustain component.
Others, here, have described it as "Hold" - same idea, different term. Either way, it seems that it is this section of the compressor's overall response
that you are looking for - that is, sustain (or hold) the compression level until the side-chain signal has ceased, then implement the (standard) release control.
The "DS" part in "ADSR" is not how the compressor is working. But if we think in compressor terms, I believe the diagram shows an Attack/Compressing/Release (ACR) envelope. But yes, the added functionality would be a release sustain parameter, so maybe ACRS. This is a thought one! :-)